Agenda and minutes

To appoint a Chair from among the Appointed (local authority) Members sitting on the Panel.  Guidance note provided by the Panel Secretariat.

Considered –

Members noted the guidance note provided by the Panel Secretariat.

Two nominations were received for the role of Panel Chair; one for Councillor Peter Wilkinson and one for Councillor Lindsay Burr.  Both were seconded.  Councillor Burr proposed that a named vote be taken for the election, which was seconded.  The Panel voted unanimously in favour of this proposal via a show of hands.

The results of the named vote for each nomination were as follows:

Nomination for Councillor Wilkinson (in alphabetical order):

Nomination for Councillor Burr (in alphabetical order):

Resolved -

That Councillor Wilkinson be elected to serve as Chair of the Panel until July 2025.

Councillor Peter Wilkinson in the Chair.

The Chair welcomed everyone to the meeting and apologies were noted.  It was noted that Councillor Murday was attending as substitute for Councillor Aldred.

All Members are invited to declare at this point any interests they have in items appearing on this agenda, including the nature of those interests.

Martin Walker declared that he is a Trustee of IDAS, which receives funding for its work from the Mayor’s office.

Councillor Steve Shaw-Wright declared for transparency that a family member is currently a serving officer with North Yorkshire Police.

Councillor Lindsay Burr declared for transparency that she is a campaigner for tackling Violence Against Women and Girls.

Mags Godderidge declared that she is CEO of Survive; a charity which is commissioned through the Mayor’s office to provide services to survivors of domestic abuse and sexual violence.

Resolved –

That the minutes of the meeting held on 12^th June 2024, having been printed and circulated, be taken as read and confirmed and signed by the Chair as a correct record.

To appoint a Vice Chair to the Panel from among the Appointed (local authority) members sitting on the Panel.  Guidance note provided by the Panel Secretariat under Item 1.

Considered –

Two nominations were put forward for Panel Vice Chair; one for Councillor Myers and one for Councillor Knight.

A show of hands was taken from the Panel for each nomination and Councillor Myers was elected as Vice Chair.

Resolved –

That Councillor Myers be elected to serve as Vice Chair of the Panel until July 2025.

To consider the exclusion of the public and press from the meeting during consideration of each of the items of business listed in column 1 of the following table on the grounds that it involves the likely disclosure of exempt information as defined in the paragraph(s) specified in column 2 of Part 1 of Schedule 12A to the Local Government Act 1972 (as amended by the Local Government (Access to Information)(Variation) Order 2006).

Resolved -

That the public and press be excluded from the meeting during consideration of Item 16 on the grounds that discussion would involve the likely disclosure of exempt information as defined in paragraph 1 of Part 1 of Schedule 12A to the Local Government Act 1972 as amended by the Local Government (Access to Information) (Variation) Order 2006.

Report from the Panel Secretariat.

Resolved –

That the Panel notes the update report on progress made against issues raised at previous Panel meetings.

·    Any member of the public, who lives, works or studies in North Yorkshire and York can ask a question to the Panel.  The question or statement must be put in writing to the Panel no later than midday on Monday, 22^nd July 2024 to Diane Parsons (contact details below). 

·    The time period for asking and responding to all questions will be limited to 30 minutes. No one question or statement shall exceed 3 minutes.

·    The full protocol can be found at www.nypartnerships.org.uk/pfcp.

A statement was provided to the Panel by Gwen Swinburn as follows:

“I realise we’re in the early stages of a big change round but notwithstanding I first wanted to raise my concerns that the membership of this committee does not reflect all the other committees under the auspices of the Combined Authority. It is an inherited committee but I think we need to ensure that this committee now has equal numbers from York and North Yorkshire if we are to have proper geographic and political representation. As of now only three Members are from York, seven from the rest of North Yorkshire. We should have five each according to the Combined Authority rules we have had to follow to date. What is the legal basis for York being denied its extra places? 

As it seems at face, and I think it is a further democratic governance issue, is the independent people having a vote. As it stands they don’t represent anyone, and have exactly the same weight as the three York Members. Can these issues be formally reviewed? 

My second concern is related to the governance arrangements of the very below radar joint audit committees. I understand there is a proposal to look at the democratic accountability, and I hope transparency, of that committee. We do see the papers now, if anyone can find them.  

Of particular concern is the last two audit meetings were both inquorate, also it seemed most people were on dial-in which we know is not the best for proper oversight, hence not allowed in most local government committees. 

The fact members are in the dark about the major audit and governance issues, and are effectively excluded from the teams meetings is exacerbated by the legal framework that in essence, limits any proper scrutiny as we know it in local government. 

So both audit and scrutiny are a long way off minimal standards we see in local government. We need to find a middle ground, to bring light to these matters.

Finally, I hope now that the responsibility of all of this lies with the Mayor and Deputy the standard local government ModGov and related practices will be quickly adopted, that could go a long way to addressing quite a few of the afore stated concerns.”

A response was provided from the Panel (read by the Secretariat) as follows:

“Thank you for bringing your questions to the Panel.

In relation to the point raised regarding membership of the Panel from the two constituent authorities, a similar question was raised by Gwen to the Panel’s meeting on 5^th of February this year and the full response form the Panel was included within the published minutes for that meeting.  As such I don’t propose to repeat the full response.  However, it spoke to the point that fundamentally, the legal basis for the Panel pre-dates and stands separately to that for the Mayoral Combined Authority so it isn’t bound by any of the same principles of the  ...  view the full minutes text for item 18.

1) Crisis care response

A question was put to the Panel on behalf of Councillor Andrew Lee in his capacity as Chair of the North Yorkshire Council Scrutiny of Health Committee, as follows:

“At the NYC Scrutiny of Health Committee’s Mid-Cycle Briefing on Friday 19 July, we were presented with concerns surrounding the crisis care response for individuals with complex mental health needs.  Councillor Paul Haslam (NYC) has raised his concerns with the Scrutiny of Health Committee on behalf of a particular resident in crisis who was met with an armed police response.  Councillor Haslam is of the view that the case presented is not an isolated one and is keen to identify how the different agencies link up around such cases and whether the support in place is working effectively.  Clearly such an issue does not just involve one agency or scrutiny committee.

To this end, I have agreed that I will facilitate co-ordination of a meeting among partners to better explore and consider the following:

·       Is the ‘Right Care, Right Person’ (RCRP) model monitored and reviewed internally within NYP?  Has it been effective in North Yorkshire and York thus far?

·       What challenges has RCRP faced, and how have these been addressed?

·       What processes are in place to co-ordinate between North Yorkshire Police and Tees Esk and Wear Valley NHS Trust, both operationally on individual cases, and strategically?

·       Are the funding levels supporting mental health care adequate, and how do they compare to funding levels across other ICBs?

I am aware that the Police, Fire and Crime Panel has a longstanding interest in scrutiny of the Mayor’s (previously Commissioner’s) oversight of the RCRP policy in terms of its implementation and efficacy.  I am therefore writing to invite the Panel Chair and Vice Chair (or other suitable representative) to attend a meeting of partners to discuss this further.  I intend that this meeting includes the following:

·       North Yorkshire Police (NYP)

·       Deputy Mayor for Police, Fire and Crime from York and North Yorkshire Combined Authority (Y&NYCA)

·       Tees, Esk and Wear Valleys NHS Foundation Trust (TEWV)

·       Humber and North Yorkshire Integrated Care Board (ICB)

·       Chair and Vice Chair of North Yorkshire Council’s Scrutiny of Health Committee (SOH)

·       Chair and Vice Chair of North Yorkshire Council’s Care and Independence Scrutiny Committee (C&I).

I will be writing to representatives of the above groups and agencies with the aim of meeting later in the year to explore these issues further.  The meeting would be internal, with a written summary provided to the public meetings of the two council Scrutiny Committees.”

Members considered the issues raised by Councillor Lee’s correspondence, noting that recent visits to the Force Control Room had highlighted an efficient triage operation.  Members raised that it would be helpful to see data behind the Right Care, Right Person (RCRP) model and whether it is evidence-based.  Concerns were raised that support through Tees, Esk and Wear Valley NHS Trust is not available 24 hours a day.  The Deputy Mayor for Policing, Fire  ...  view the full minutes text for item 19.

Update report from the Mayoral office on the inspection report published in March 2024 and how the force are being held to account over their progress.  A copy of the inspection report is provided for reference, along with a cover report from the OPFCC.

Considered –

The update report provided to Panel regarding progress made against the recent inspection by HMICFRS of North Yorkshire Police.

The Panel commended the significant improvements made.  A number of other aspects were highlighted as concerns or queries to the Mayor, which included:

-        the level of victim withdrawal;

-        poor inspection outcomes in relation to the investigation of crime;

-        ensuring that securing a trial or conviction aren’t seen as the only outcomes for victims but looking holistically at what’s needed; and

-        efforts to retain and support staff.

The DMPFC acknowledged the need to get victim support right and to do better within the resources available.  DCC Bisset highlighted a national shortage of detectives and that the service now has multiple entry routes to improve this locally.  Operation Soteria outcomes are being embedded to help change how the service investigates and improves its outcome rates on serious sexual violence and rape cases.  The DMPFC also highlighted that there is likely to be national movement around improving response to spiking incidents.  In relation to staff welfare, the DMPFC recognised the challenges faced by staff and the need to ensure support is available to both back office and frontline staff at all levels.

Resolved –

That the Panel notes the update report provided on progress against inspection outcomes within North Yorkshire Police.

For the Panel to review and make recommendations on the draft report of former Police, Fire and Crime Commissioner Zoë Metcalfe.  The Panel must provide a statutory report with any recommendations made.

Considered –

The draft Policing and Crime Annual Report for 2023/24.

The Panel were reminded that this report and that for fire and rescue are provided on behalf of the former Police, Fire and Crime Commissioner, Zoe Metcalfe and comments were sought.

The Panel felt that overall the draft report reads very well and is accessible in terms of language and content to communities.  Some specific observations and comments were made by the Panel for further consideration in relation to the draft report, as outlined below. 

a)    Members had recommended in 2023 that information could be provided on the average time taken to respond to police complaints and noted that this was omitted again from the 2023/24 draft.  It was noted that the DMPFC will provide this information separately but the Panel would be grateful for this to be taken into consideration for a future draft as it would provide a richer picture on police complaints handling.

b)    The Panel sought reassurance that the development of the new Sexual Assault Referral Centre (SARC) in York will not be hindered by further delays as it will provide an important service for victims in the area.  The Panel welcomed the DMPFC’s reassurance on this matter and commitment to provide a written update, in addition to noting that should delays be encountered it would be helpful to engage with local authority partners further.

In addition, it was highlighted by the Panel that North Yorkshire Police does not currently appear to be listed as a ‘White Ribbon’ accredited organisation but were provided with reassurance by DCC Bisset on this point and that this will be rectified in due course.

Resolved –

That the Panel:

(a) recommends that the draft Policing and Crime Annual Report 2023/24 be approved, subject to the Mayor’s further consideration of the issues raised; and

(b) receives an update from the DMPFC on progress with the build of the SARC in York.

For the Panel to review and make recommendations on the draft report of the former Police, Fire and Crime Commissioner, Zoë Metcalfe.  The Panel must provide a statutory report with any recommendations made.

Considered –

The draft Fire and Rescue Annual Report 2023/24.

The Panel felt that the style and language of the report similarly reads well to the policing and crime report. Several specific queries and comments were raised as outlined below:

·       Page 105 refers to investment into prevention and protection teams and Panel would welcome further detail on this;

·       Page 105 refers to there being “no notable increase in response times to incidents in the Huntington area” following the implementation of the Risk and Resource Model.  Members asked for further detail to better understand this;

·       It was highlighted that the North Yorkshire Fire and Rescue Service is the worst performing service in the country based on recent data so Members expressed concerns that the draft report does not reflect this and as such the following information was requested for the Panel’s October meeting:

o   Detail of appliance availability of fire engines across the area;

o   An update on the FBU Critical Safety Notice issued this year.  The DMPFC was urged to meet with the FBU to better understand their concerns.

The DMPFC agreed to revert in writing to the Panel on points raised, with further detail.  A more substantive review of the Risk and Resource Model will be brought to Panel in October 2024 which will incorporate these updates.

Resolved –

That the Panel:

(a) recommends that the draft Fire and Rescue Annual Report 2023/24 be approved; and

(b) receives further information in response to the detailed queries raised during discussion on the draft report for its next meeting.

Draft report for approval by the Panel.

Considered –

The draft Annual Report of the Police, Fire and Crime Panel for 2023/24.

Members endorsed the draft report, with the suggestion that an amendment may be helpful around the update on the development of the Sexual Assault Referral Centre in York to reflect the further delays.

It was noted that a one-page summary will be shared with Members of the constituent authorities, with a link to the full published report.

Resolved –

That the Panel agrees its Annual Report 2023/24, subject to minor amendment.

Report by the Panel Secretariat.

Resolved –

That the Panel agrees its outline work programme.

Report presented by Simon Dennis on behalf of the programme, providing Panel with an overview and appraisal of its development and delivery.

Considered –

The published reports to the Panel regarding the progress of the EnableNY shared services collaboration.

Simon Dennis introduced the material by outlining the challenging aspects which had impacted the progress of the programme.  Simon spoke to the difficulties of re-designing services at the same time as endeavouring to baseline efficiency and effectiveness and how the re-shaping of the collaboration in 2023 resulted in being able to address aspects of the design which could on reflection have been better modelled at the start.  A review has been taken independently of the programme and the report shared privately with the Panel, incorporating potential options for consideration by the partners involved.  These have not yet been through the appropriate decision-making channels or shared with staff representatives and as such cannot be shared publicly.  Simon acknowledged that aspects of this report are not as positive as would be desired but that it’s important now to commit to a forward programme of review for both services.  The MCA is a party to this collaboration and discussions are underway to consider how that collaboration might best serve the needs of the MCA itself.

The Panel thanked Simon for the information provided.  Due to the nature of the confidential reports the Panel proposed and seconded to retire into closed session to be able to consider the confidential material provided on the rising of the Panel.

Resolved –

That the Panel notes the published papers and verbal update provided regarding the progress of the EnableNY programme.

Any other items which the Chair agrees should be considered as a matter of urgency because of special circumstances.

The Panel were advised that no urgent items had been raised with the Chair.

Thursday, 10 October 2024 at 10:30am – City of York Council’s West Offices.

The Panel were notified that the next meeting will be held on Thursday, 10^th October 2024 at 10:30am at City of York Council’s West Offices.

For the Panel to consider information exempted from publication as outlined at Item 6, should the Panel deem that this is required.

The Chair brought the meeting of the Panel held in public to a close and following a short break the Panel moved into closed session to consider the material exempted from publication under Item 15.